On friendship plots/subplots in games.

[aruru]

A comment a few days ago from a conversation with ruaki (regarding Yuri and Flynn's friendship in Tales of Vesperia) leads to me totally having a nostalgia-attack and thus fangirling over Tosh and Shu's friendship in the original Arc the Lad trilogy. (Warning: Spoilers for Vesperia in the original entry [mainly, the comic linked] and in the comment linked above, and spoilers for a subplot in AtL 3 in my comment... though that game is several years old already, so it might not matter to anyone.)

Seriously, I think my summary of the AtL 3 subplot in question is one of the times I've best been able to explain (by example) why I like those two so much, both as best friends AND as a smokin' hot! pairing, so I felt like sharing. (I know it's incredibly hard to find now, but I DEMAND THAT MORE PEOPLE PLAY THE ORIGINAL TRILOGY, GODDAMMIT! WE NEED MORE FANS!!! ESPECIALLY OF TOSH x SHU!!! >O)



Anyway... so, since I figure it might be an interesting subject to some of you reading this: Does anyone else here have their own "Friend vs. Friend story where the friendship mattered, but without the theme taking over the entire plot"-type of duos (Or trios? Or maybe polygons? Haha... XD) to share? Doesn't necessarily have to be games, if you don't want it to be or can't think of one in that particular category... :)

Comments

[arex.livejournal.com]

You mean Shu and Shante. :D

My thoughts on ya- I mean, relationships! in Arc the Lad (part 1)

[aruru.livejournal.com]

LOL... just kidding, yo. For one thing, I don't like to impose my opinions on others on anything, especially something as trivial as pairings (No matter how much I'll fangirl and wave my support flags, I still don't like to do that, so I try to check myself when I say stuff.). Secondly, that's a pair I'm actually just fine with, though the degree of how much I'm in agreement with it will vary depending on which specific canon we're talking about - anime, manga, or game? Because my views are slightly different in each one.

In case you're curious to know, here's how each canon works for me:

(Note - I am NOT trying to get you to agree with me on any of this, I just felt like sharing my thoughts because I'm feeling really talkative today and fangirling over AtL is a weakness of mine. I hope you're not offended by it. ^^;;)


Anime - Okay, this one's pretty much set in stone, as there's that brief off-screen sex scene between the two of them in the first DVD (Forgot which ep it was exactly, but it was one of the last ones on the disc, the ep where they were at Shante's pub drinking and discussing her search for her brother.). Anyway, it's pretty clear they have some kind of romantic/sexual relationship going on, though exactly how close (What I mean is, is it just a "casual" thing for them, or is there more to it?) is still left slightly in the air, as we don't get much more details on the subject after that particular scenario.

Still, as I said, it's pretty much there, so maybe more details aren't actually needed (unless you're a fanficcer and just LOVE little details to work off of).

Although... I did find it kind of hilarious that they did keep a little detail of Tosh and Shu's camaraderie despite the fact that (in anime canon) they only first meet (and have the junkyard fight) really, REALLY late in the series (and for totally different reasons than they did in the game, though that doesn't really affect this discussion); and that was when in the moments they're starting the final battle, Shu's going off on his own, and suddenly is followed by Tosh, who IIRC said something that was basically "I'm not letting you go fight all alone," and that was really an LMAO moment for me because dude, you guys practically only just met in this version of canon! WTF?! Wow, Tosh, you really are gay for him! ;D


Manga - Alright, now this one is a slightly different beast, because I can easily see Shu going either way in this canon. Why? Because in this one, Shante actually does kiss Shu early in the story (I think it was some kind of "thank you" kiss, but still, the attraction showed.), and later on in one of the final volumes of the manga, he saves Shante from some mind-control thing the bad guys had implanted on her... and actually got hurt by her in the process (I'm a bit iffy on what exactly happened as I haven't looked at the manga in ages, but that was the basic gist of things. IIRC, she stabbed him while he was trying to get her to come to her senses.). Anyway, the manga clearly shows that he does care for her in some manner.

However, on the other hand, the manga IS the same canon that has a drunken Tosh crawling on top of an equally drunk Shu to give him more booze (Which I once scanned a long time ago for chaoscheebs and posted here, but I think the links are long dead, and I lost the files when the old comp died. :( I don't think I have them stored anywhere else, either, and now my scanner doesn't work, so I can't show you either that [not that you probably want to see THAT, LOL XD] OR the Shante scenes, which I'm sure you'd be interested in. Sadpants. ;_;), AND this version of the series ends with the two of them going off riding into the sunset and adventuring together, so... maybe Shu plays both of the fields, LOL I dunno, the canon in this version works either way for me.

My thoughts on ya- I mean, relationships! in Arc the Lad (part 2)

[aruru.livejournal.com]

[cont.]

Games - Okay, here's the thing: While I'm NOT against a Shu/Shante relationship here, and there IS some material to work off of (I'm mainly thinking when they're working together to try to break out of the Romalian battleship and then get separated when Shante gets blown off by the strong winds, and in AtL 3 when Shante talks about having an "old friend" who's a Hunter... I think I'm forgetting one more thing, but anyhow, you get the idea.), I DO think this canon is the "weakest" to work from for their relationship, as it doesn't seem to emphazise their camaraderie as much as the other two canons... at least, not from Shu's side. (For example, I could be totally wrong, but I don't recall him mentioning her at all in AtL 3. Meanwhile, his relationship with Tosh gets a whole lot of emphasis in both AtL 2 AND 3, culminating with that whole scenario with the water sphere in the third game.)

Additionally, I also felt that Shante's relationship with Gruga in AtL 2 was somewhat better developed overall (Especially when she bitchslapped him in order to make him come to his senses and go get his daughter back - that was pretty awesome. Go Shante! XD), which made me more partial for a Gruga/Shante pairing than a Shu/Shante one. I don't know if I'd still feel this way if I played the game again nowadays, but that's how I came out feeling then, so... guess that's how I roll, pretty much.



Anyway, to summarize: Yes, Shante's cool with me. As for canon with Shu, my feelings are - Anime = Yes, Manga = There's Something There so Possibly, Depending on What I'm in the Mood For, and Games = I'm Cool With It, Though I Did Prefer the Dynamic with Gruga.

But those are just my opinions, I could be wrong. Except when I'm not. ;D


Anyhow... hope I didn't bore you to tears or offend you with that! :O I just felt chatty tonight and... got carried away. Sorry. ^^;;

Re: My thoughts on ya- I mean, relationships! in Arc the Lad (part 2)

[arex.livejournal.com]

I'd have to replay the games and re-watch the anime (which is slightly painful because I didn't think it was that great) since I remember so little of how everything worked out other than Arc and Kukuru die.

Re: My thoughts on ya- I mean, relationships! in Arc the Lad (part 2)

[aruru.livejournal.com]

LOL yeah, the anime was admittedly kinda lame. I did like seeing the cast in anime format (even though the designs weren't particularly "wow"-inducing for the most part), but even that didn't help wash away the aura of suck it had. Sapants. ;_;

And LMAO... ack, I hope I didn't annoy you, then! :O Sometimes I forget people don't develop the same attachments to stuff that I do (same way that sometimes I don't develop attachments to other people's favorite stuff), and then I go off on some part of something that I particularly liked (and thus latched onto), and people are all left like "Huh?!" at it. My bad, dude. I just really, REALLY loved the original AtL trilogy. ^^;;


(Speaking of Arc and Kukuru, I really wish they'd had gotten better lead-up to/development as a couple. :( Their romantic relationship just kinda seemed to have come out of nowhere... heck, Arc himself should've had better chara development, period.)

Re: My thoughts on ya- I mean, relationships! in Arc the Lad (part 2)

[arex.livejournal.com]

I develop attachments to things like that too!

I'm just partial to going with the hetero option first and foremost until Word of God says otherwise. Maybe it's just because I see the 'they're good friends, so they must be gay' thing to be weird since my best friend were super close, but we were definitely not spending our summer vacation at Camp Gay after a cruise on the loveboat. Or it could be my natural urge to hate everything someone loves loathe fandoms rain on people's parades play Devil's Advocate because I'm the Scion of Balance maintain a counterbalance in everything.

(Damn you TV Tropes.)

Counterbalancing your counterbalance? XD (Nah, don't think I am, I'm just babbling at this point...)

[aruru.livejournal.com]

First off: Nice tatt! I don't think I could ever show my attachment to a fandom by way of permanent body art (just too scared it'll hurt, plus I worry that I'd regret it later, haha), but I can appreciate it on someone else! :D


Anyway, I just wanted to say that, despite my massive doses of fangirling making it look like the contrary, I actually DON'T think "good friends = they MUST be gaygayGAY!" (or even "good friends = they MUST have a romantic relationship!" for hetero pairs) in reality. It just doesn't work that way in most relationships - things are more complex than that.

The reasons why I ship most of my ships are twofold: Firstly, because of obvious aesthetic reasons (Because I won't deny that all the stuff I ship - het, yaoi, OR yuri - are things I find "hot" in some manner or other. And by "hot" I don't necessarily mean the charas are pretty to look at - sometimes it's the character dynamics/interaction that touches on my sense of... I guess we could call them "personality aesthetics?" Does that make sense?).

Secondly, because I enjoy thinking of "what ifs" - in other words, the possibilities an "alternate storyline/relationship dynamic/etc." could bring (And to me, all fanworks are essentially alternate realities, regardless of whether they follow canon to the letter, or play fast and loose with AUs, because none of 'em were done by the original creator[s]... and heck, considering some creators even make their own AUs/crossovers [CLAMP's Tsubasa comes to mind], we even have alternate realities of alternate realities, haha... XD). And sometimes those "what ifs" for me... well, a lot of them turn out to go to the Gay Side of the force, LOL. XD I'm not sure why is that - perhaps force of habit or something.

I'm sure there are other reasons too, but I can't really think of them at the moment.

Anyway... in my opinion, what it all boils down to is basically: Certain kinks will push certain people's buttons, and not others, and that's Perfectly Normal and Fine, and if more people would just learn this, we'd have a lot less drama going on and develop better understanding of one another. Also, while you can sometimes learn a few things from looking at someone's tastes/kinks, it does not mean that a personal kink/taste is wholly representative of that person (Easiest example I can think of for this last bit is that, despite how often I love to gush over "Big Beefy Ukes Manly Men" in games/anime/other works of fiction, my actual taste in "real-life" men is actually pretty... well, usually average build. Sometimes I even like slender or awkward-looking guys, as long as they look strong & sturdy for their build.); and That Is Okay Too.



...and you probably already know all this, since you've been so cool about things in this conversation thus far, so maybe I'm being redundant? Stop me, I'm turning into a sermon service today, ack. XD





(And I have heard of the suck-you-in-for-hours evil of TV Tropes, so I am NOT touching it tonight, as I got to go in a little while. Besides, I've already fallen in that trap by Wikipedia in the past, heh. XD)